Interview with Forged In Fire O.G. Matthew Parkinson

Matthew Parkinson is part owner of Dragon’s Breath Forge in Wolcott, Connecticut. He has over twenty years of experience as a bladesmith, and although he admits he’s tried to quit several times, his passion for forging will not allow it.

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Matt won the first-ever aired episode of Forged in Fire and returned in season three for a Champions Tournament. He shared with us how he got on the show, his appearance on the unaired pilot, the history of Dragon’s Breath Forge, and how his passion for forging sparked a love of teaching.

Matt’s bladesmithing origin story

BRUTE de FORGE: How did you get into forging and bladesmithing?

Matt Parkinson: I had always wanted to do it. I started blacksmithing in high school—which is longer than I like to think about—and I started making knives around the same time. My first couple were stock removal. But I just always wanted to be a blacksmith. I always wanted to work with forging, but I didn’t think people did that anymore, so I was doing it as a hobby.

Then, I went to tech school for machine shop, and when I finished, I decided I didn't like it. Tight tolerances suck, and I don't like them. They're stressful.

“I just always wanted to be a blacksmith.”

Now I make folding knives! I firmly believe that anybody who wants to be a knife maker needs to have a wide streak of sadomasochism. Otherwise, you just can't do this. (laughing).

BDF: Are you a full-time bladesmith?

MP: I've been a full-time blacksmith and bladesmith for about twenty-five years. I've essentially been doing nothing but knives and swords for the last ten years.

BDF: Do you have a preference for knives versus swords?

MP: It varies depending on what I'm working on. Sometimes it seems like the thing I'm working on is not the thing I want to be working on. But I really like making swords and chef's knives, and I have been chasing some ideas in pattern welding. Those are a few of my favorite things.

BDF: And you work out of Dragon’s Breath Forge primarily, right?

MP: Yeah. So, Jamie, Peter Burt, and I started Dragon's Breath Forge when we started our ironwork company, Falling Hammer Productions, in 2005. Then we ran that company together until Peter left for Hawaii in 2018. At which point, we completely shut down the ironworks part of the company. It's really just Dragon's Breath Forge now. Then Matt [Berry] joined the company in 2020.

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There have been a few others come through that worked with us. Michael Coffey was a member of the shop for many years. Mareko Maumasi joined for a couple of years after Michael left. So, there's been a lot of smiths who have moved through Dragon's Breath Forge.

Breathing life into Dragon’s Breath Forge

BDF: How did Dragon’s Breath Forge begin?

MP: Before Dragon's Breath Forge and before Falling Hammer Productions, I had another shop named MP Metalworks. I was doing that at renaissance fairs for five or six years. Then, Peter, who I had taken a class with before, called me up and was like, “Hey, I'm going to start doing renaissance fairs. How about instead of competing with you, we join forces?” I said yes because it's a lot of work. So, we joined forces.

Then he had a client in the shop doing a lot of component ironwork. At first, we were looking for a shop to move everybody into, but we moved into what was Peter's shop and expanded a bit. Jamie was Peter's apprentice at the time, and he was able to finish his apprenticeship, so when we formed the company, we all came in as equal partners.

There's been ups and downs. It’s been a long time. We’ve been in business for eighteen years, but getting our footing definitely took a while.

BDF: I know last week you were away teaching classes. Do you also have classes at Dragon’s Breath?

MP: I teach all over the country! Currently, the farthest I've gone is Arizona. I taught there a couple of times. I've gone down south as far as Arkansas. But I teach all over the Northeast. I really like teaching. I like the fact that it pays for my travel. I do tend to over-schedule myself sometimes, which I need to stop doing.

We built out the classroom here in 2020. We had been teaching in the shop for several years and decided to go all in on the teaching and make a studio. So, we cleared a room, put some money into it, and made a teaching studio. Then, 2020 happened. We spent all this money and then couldn’t do anything.

Finally, we opened the classroom in 2021, and it has been amazing. Having taught in so many different schools, I was able to take things that I didn't like about other classrooms I’ve taught in and not do those things. For example, I have taught at schools that don’t have enough grinders for everybody. So, we only take six students, and we have six grinders. All the grinders are the same, so that I can demo on one grinder, and everybody understands how to work their grinder. There's enough space for everybody. There's nothing on the floor; everything's clean. It's a very nice space to teach in.

“I have taught at schools that don’t have enough grinders for everybody. So, we only take six students, and we have six grinders.”

BDF: Those are probably pretty busy classes, I’m sure.

MP: Yeah, we pretty regularly sell out. Usually quickly. We probably should raise our prices, but I don’t want to. We would rather keep adding classes.

Matt’s passion for teaching

BDF: What is it about teaching that you enjoy so much?

MP: I enjoy sharing the craft. I learn a lot and get better through teaching. Students will screw things up in the most interesting and unique ways, and, as a teacher, you have to figure out how to fix it. It forces me to be better that way but also makes me look at my process and break it down into steps. It makes you think about what you're doing, why you're doing it, and how you're doing it. In the end, that makes you better at your craft.

Being a good teacher is different than being a good smith; you have to be able to self-examine the process and then be able to express that to the student. I enjoy doing that. But I also like inspiring others and watching them get excited about making their first knife or learning something new. That's very fulfilling.

“ I enjoy sharing the craft. I learn a lot and get better through teaching.”

I remember the first time I taught; I had just gotten married and was a little short on money. The shop was slow. Peter had hooked me up with Brookfield Craft Center, which is where he used to teach. He put a good word in for me, and I taught a couple of classes there. I remember the first class I taught, I was super nervous, but when it was over, I remember thinking it was so cool. I spent all day talking about blacksmithing, and nobody shut me up. It was awesome, and I got paid for it! It was an epiphany.

BDF: That's great that you've been able to do it for so long. That's hard for a lot of people.

MP: From the business side of it, classes are nice because they are contained. You do the thing, you get paid, and you're done. That's it. It gives me enough income to mostly do whatever I want in the shop. I can take on commissions that aren't necessarily profitable because I don't need that income to support the shop or my overhead. The school can mostly cover all of the overhead of the building and the shop, which allows us the freedom to be more artistic.

BDF: What is it about forging that you fell in love with?

MP: I like hitting stuff! There's no part of this I don't enjoy. Forging is my first love. The first time I saw a blacksmith, I was six years old. I walked into a living history place, my dad threw me up on his shoulders, and I watched the blacksmith hit the steel. Sparks flew, and I thought, “I want to do that!” That has never really changed. I'm still six years old on the inside wanting to do that.

“I like hitting stuff! There’s no part of this I don’t enjoy. Forging is my first love.”

That's where the inspiration came from, but as I got better at it and learned to control it, I found that I liked learning about metalworking in general. There's always a new avenue to pursue, a new skill set to achieve, and new ideas. It's never-ending for me. I'm always learning and setting new goals.

Trust me; I've tried to quit many times. I can't. It's just not going to happen.

Matt’s blacksmithing inspirations

BDF: Are there any blacksmiths that inspire you?

MP: There are several guys that are working that I’m inspired by or at least stealing ideas from.

Inspiration is the thing of distance. The people who inspire me are not people I know, but I see their work floating around. Influence is a matter of closeness. People who influence my work are the people I hang out with and talk to and know. That's a different thing.

But for both, there are definitely people that are so good. And some of them even cross the line between the inspire and influence. Peter Johnson is a friend of mine. I don't get to see him very often because he lives in Sweden, but he's definitely both an influence and an inspiration. His attitude toward the sword and how he thinks about the sword is definitely both an inspiration and an influence to me.

BDF: Has there been a favorite project that you've worked on?

MP: Yes and no. It depends. I'm never 100% happy with any project until it’s over. One will come up on the computer, and I’ll think, “That was cool.” After a time, you forget about all the screw-ups and the small bits that changed. That’s the nature of this work; the more advanced you become at it, the smaller the details you start to look at and the more your vision narrows. You’ve just built a five-foot sword, and you're looking at scratches that are just microscopic, and you're pissed. After a certain point, you hate it because there are little things you can't fix. But then you look at it a year later, five years later, and then you're like, “That was a pretty cool sword.”

There was one I did about ten years ago that’s one of my favorites. It was for a good customer named Pete, who bought a bunch of stuff from me. He ordered an inlaid Viking sword. The blade was inlaid, and the guard was inlaid; everything was inlaid. There was a ridiculous amount of silver involved. It was a cool sword. I was really happy with the way it came out. If I had a masterpiece, that one would be it. It was like my level-up piece.

BDF: Do you have a style when you're forging your blades?

MP: I'm told I have a style, but I don't really see it. I like certain lines and shapes that I put in my work. I've been told people can see my work from across the room and know it's mine. So, I have a style, but I don't know that it's intentional.

Matt’s road to Forged In Fire

BDF: You were on the unaired pilot of Forged in Fire. How did that come about?

MP: Yes, I was! So, I stayed home with my son for the first year and a half. My wife's a school teacher, and she went back to work while I stayed home with Thomas. There was an open casting call that was passed around. A few people I knew had it, so I asked them to pass it on to me. I wanted to put my hat in the ring for it.

They called me and did Skype interview. A couple of other guys around here did it, too. Peter and Jamie interviewed with them as well. I'm driving home from work one day, and I get this phone call, and they're like, “Okay, so your flight is going to leave this day, you're flying out, and you need to be here with two shirts of each color.” They didn't even bother to tell me that I got picked. They just called me to say it's all set up. I got home and said, “Apparently, I'm going to Seattle.”

Then I remember production called me up a year later or so, and they were like, “Do you have the number of your business partners because we are doing a season.” I told them I'd like to return, and they said I could. I was on the second episode filmed, but it was the first one to air.

BDF: And then you returned for Battle of Champions with Burt Foster, Salem Straub, and Ben Abbott. How did filming the three episodes compare? Were there a lot of changes between your unaired pilot and the other two episodes?

MP: It was definitely smoother between the first and third seasons. They had gotten into a rhythm by the third time I filmed. There was not a lot of change between the unaired pilot and the first aired episode.

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I’m not sure I’d go back now. So much has changed. My health probably wouldn’t let me. I almost died last time. I’m asthmatic anyway, and I was so run down from being ill, taking my journeyman smith test, prepping for blade shows, and everything else that I was running on empty by the time I went to film.

Matt is a Mastersmith in the making

BDF: Have you achieved your rank of Mastersmith?

MP: Not yet. I have done the performance test twice now. I did a performance test for the first time in 2018 and passed under JD Smith. Then I was going to try to submit it in 2019. I put that together, and I wasn't happy with it and decided not to submit it. Then in 2020, I was supposed to be in New York demoing for the ABANDA Conference, so I wasn’t going to put a set together for Atlanta since I couldn’t go. I was going to try and put one together for ICCE, but they said we couldn't test there. So, 2020 was out.

Then for 2021, I didn’t think blade shows would happen, so I didn't build a set. It ended up happening, and I could have tested, but I didn't. That was the last year I could test under my old performance test because you must submit it within three years of your performance test.

I performance tested again under Christoph Deringer and Lin Rhea last July. I was going to try to get set together for Blade this year, but I was sick all winter and couldn’t. I have now cleared my schedule, and as soon as I finish a couple of knives on my bench for the show next week, I'm going to start on the Mastersmith set. Hopefully, it can be ready for Ohio on August 25th, 2023. If I don't finish it by then, I'll test it late next year. That's the plan.

BDF: Your schedule will be busy coming up.

MP: As I said, I overscheduled myself. I haven’t had a day off in seven weeks! On top of everything, there are a bunch of classes coming up in May. June is Blade Show Atlanta. After that, I'm in Indiana for a week, New York for a week, away demoing, and home in between. I have a knife show coming up in Mystic, Connecticut, in two weeks.

I’m so busy. I don't know what I was thinking.

Matt’s advice for aspiring bladesmiths

BDF: Do you have any advice for aspiring bladesmiths?

MP: Don't do it for a living. It is hard. Don't do it for a living and get a real job.

Honestly, I'm all for more people doing high-end work because it grows the market as a whole whenever you get somebody new to the market. It's not a zero-sum game. We are not going to compete, and I’m not going to lose my customers—it doesn't work that way. The reason I say get a real job and then do this in your free time is that it's freaking expensive to set up a shop! If you count it all out, we probably have a million dollars in equipment. If you don’t have enough equipment, it is really hard to make a profit. So, building up a shop by your bootstraps is not something you should do. I tried, and it sucks.

“It’s not a zero-sum game. We are not going to compete, and I’m not going to lose my customers—it doesn’t work that way.”

When I started, I inherited my grandfather's shop, which had become a repository for family stuff. There were woodworking tools, machine tools, and all kinds of stuff. His shop became the nucleus of my shop. Then, I built up around that as I started to buy more tools and equipment. But I still wouldn't have been able to have build-up without Jamie and Peter also having their shops coming in. It took three of us putting money into the shop, and even then, there was no money for many years. If it weren't for my wife paying the bills, we would have been screwed.

It took me twenty years of being in business to be able to make enough money to survive.

So, marrying a supportive person would also be good advice.

MP: Yes! Preferably with a good job and insurance.

What’s next for Dragon’s Breath Forge

BDF: Does Dragon’s Breath Forge have anything in the works we should be on the lookout for?

MP: We are slowly upgrading the classroom. That's the big thing right now. We rebuilt both our power hammers, and we're constantly upgrading and fixing the building. We're trying to get a couple of hydraulic presses in for the classrooms so that we can expand that. We are going to start doing more Damascus classes. There are a few different plans in the works.

To see more of Matt’s work, follow him @swordmatt and Dragon’s Breath Forge @dragons_breath_forge on Instagram. You can also check out their website at dragonsbreathforge.com.